Habitat - Indoor :: 1200 GPH Custom Filtration System

Turtle tank setups and other indoor configurations.

Post Posted: Sun Jul 17, 2011 11:34 pm   1200 GPH Custom Filtration System

this was a work in progress since December, working on it every so often while taking long breaks while being away at school. Just now FINALLY finished, and I'm extremely pleased with how it turned out. 180 gallon tank, with a 30 gallon container being used to hold the filter media. It's powered by a 1200 GPH Pondmaster Model 12 pump. There are bio-balls in the PVC pipe as well for the biological filtration.

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Custom made cartridges, using 3 currently, can hold up to 5. The two white ones are the mechanical filtration, the first one is 300 microns and the second is 100 microns filter pad. The blue one has activated carbon in it for chemical filtration.

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Water comes into the filter media tank here

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This is how tall the stand is that it sits on to put it into perspective

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All closed up to cut down on evaporation

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Outlet, gives you an idea of the amount of water and speed that's coming out. There are bio-balls in this PVC pipe.

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Outlet from the inside

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After an hour of running, it's already pulled this much, performing wayyy better than that old Emperor 400 I was using..

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Two blue filter pads are mashed together with acrylic to hold the activated carbon inside of it

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There's my custom filtration system! Let me know what everyone thinks, comments, questions, concerns are all welcome :)
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Post Posted: Mon Jul 18, 2011 2:12 am   Re: 1200 GPH Custom Filtration System

My concern.....

U need to clean ur freakin house hahahahaha jk
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Post Posted: Mon Jul 18, 2011 9:03 am   Re: 1200 GPH Custom Filtration System

it's the basement, the man cave, and I live at school 8 months out of the year, and a lot of that stuff is stuff from my dorm, so it all gets cleaner when I go back to school ;)
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Post Posted: Mon Jul 18, 2011 10:15 am   Re: 1200 GPH Custom Filtration System

Very nice! Huge media capacity there too. I'd make sure that's all plugged into a GFCI though. Also, I think people generally avoid using garden hoses for tubing (and even for tank filling). I think it has something to do with the plasticizers in it (not sure).
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Post Posted: Mon Jul 18, 2011 11:10 am   Re: 1200 GPH Custom Filtration System

haha, using a GFCI for anything electrical, whether or not it is around water, is a must do in my book. Thanks for the tip though! I had never heard anything about garden hoses for tubing, very interesting. With some googling I found this:

http://www.monsterfishkeepers.com/forum ... 26791.html

The vibe I got from that and from other things I read was this:
-Everyone recommend de-chlorinating the water, and this is something that is done regardless of what sort of hose to use, so I'm safe here
-Resting water can possibly eventually cause high concentrations of chemicals in the hose to seep into it, so this MIGHT be an issue
-Heat is what really makes the chemicals come out, if there are any to worry about at all
-If it's a new garden hose, flush it with water for awhile first

So the impression I have so far is that using the garden hose for tubing is not a big deal, especially since I have flushed it. I've been using a garden hose to fill my tank for 18 years and never had an issue, however you raise a very good point Steve that if there is any harm, this will only be amplified by using it for my filtration process.

I'm going to do more research, and more input on this issue is very much welcomed, especially with sources cited or just past experiences are welcome, but for now my gut feeling is that newer garden hoses are probably safe given all the eco-friendly awareness that has seemingly washed over every product over the last decade.

Again, comments, questions, concerns on the whole filter, especially the garden hose issue that Steve brought up? Thanks again for mentioning that Steve, it's an excellent point!
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Post Posted: Mon Jul 18, 2011 12:10 pm   Re: 1200 GPH Custom Filtration System

The pads are cool for mechanical filtration, but for your bio filter and your chemical why not have containers with holes or like mesh canisters / boxes that sit in the water path so you could change the media easier? It looks like you made a custom filter to hold your carbon, which will exaust in a few days to a few weeks... you'll be opening that and replacing the carbon often.

Also bio balls don't have that much surface area. You're much better off using spun glass / ceramic bio media (rings or nuggets) for your bio surface area. Bio Balls work best in a wet/dry trickle filter. The vast majority of your filtration system should be biological filtration. Do you only have bio media in that small length of PVC pipe?

What is that white stuff where the hose is connected? Why not just drill and use a bulkhead?

Looks like a great start... could you post a few pics of the pump and the plumbing?

Also, the Jimmy Johns sign. Excellent IDEA. I assume you are using that to make the nitrifying bacteria hungry and get them to eat more. :D
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Post Posted: Mon Jul 18, 2011 12:26 pm   Re: 1200 GPH Custom Filtration System

VERY COOL!!
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Post Posted: Mon Jul 18, 2011 2:20 pm   Re: 1200 GPH Custom Filtration System

Thanks for the compliment giovani :)

Great points Veipa! I'll answer your questions as best as I can:
*for your bio filter and your chemical why not have containers with holes or like mesh canisters / boxes that sit in the water path so you could change the media easier?

-The problem with this would be actually finding/ making canisters to sit in the box I made that will force water through them for chemical filtration without running the risk of anything clogging. I mean yeah i could put something right in front of the exit to make it smaller, but then it was have a smaller surface area, and again, run the risk of clogging and flooding my house, haha! If you have design/product ideas that would work well, could you draw/link me to them?

* It looks like you made a custom filter to hold your carbon, which will exaust in a few days to a few weeks... you'll be opening that and replacing the carbon often.
-There is a top center screw that comes off, and I can unscrew that, and pour it out and I have a funnel and I can just pour fresh carbon right back in! Already tested and it works pretty easily, again, if you know of an even faster way that will safely work, please let me know!!

*Also bio balls don't have that much surface area. You're much better off using spun glass / ceramic bio media (rings or nuggets) for your bio surface area.

-http://www.aquariumguys.com/ehfimech1.html how do those look? about how heavy are they? can these be completely submerged and still work properly? If i switch to these I'd like to just put them in the same place as the bio balls inside that PVC tube, it's 2 feet long, 2 inches in diameter.

*Bio Balls work best in a wet/dry trickle filter.
-Well the water comes around in that PVC and there's actually a decent amount of splashing created inside of that tube from the speed that it's going through and having to make that 90 degree turn, so doesn't this accomplish the wet/dry effect by having the water splash over the bio balls? Yes they are also half submerged, however the tops are getting the splash effect. I've thought about putting a mister in there to really accomplish the wet/dry effect in that pipe, would that work for the bio balls?

*The vast majority of your filtration system should be biological filtration.
-I've never heard of this, do you have a reference that I can look at to get a better idea of how much bio filtration I need?

*Do you only have bio media in that small length of PVC pipe?
-Yes

*What is that white stuff where the hose is connected? Why not just drill and use a bulkhead?
-The white stuff is Silicone II as a preventative measure for leaks. That is a bulkhead, but there was an extremely slow leak still and so I just went ahead and added Silicone II all around it, inside and outside for precautionary reasons.

*Looks like a great start... could you post a few pics of the pump and the plumbing?
-Thanks! I will get you a picture this evening of the pump, you could search on amazon for 1200 GPH Pondmaster Model 12 if you just wanted to see the pump itself, but if you want to see it's positioning I'll get that this evening. There's not really much to the plumbing, I've got that garden hose and it just loops around, I plan on cutting it down to size within the week so I don't trip over it. The way I have it setup currently, there is actually a current in there, it's basically a slow "whirl pool," the exit pushes the water around and the pump pulls it, not really strong, but still a nice little one.

*Also, the Jimmy Johns sign. Excellent IDEA. I assume you are using that to make the nitrifying bacteria hungry and get them to eat more
-Of course! hahaha!
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Post Posted: Mon Jul 18, 2011 9:56 pm   Re: 1200 GPH Custom Filtration System

I'm sure there's some kind of DIY box or even something off the shelf that would work for holding your carbon. If your design is tested and working... sweet!

All of the bio media is for the most part the same. Cheapest is best. Check this out...
http://cgi.ebay.com/4x-1L-Odyssea-Glass ... 0223250752
If you're going to buy eheim bio media, the eheim substrat pro is great, but it's pricey. It's smaller pieces than the noodle / rings

Honestly your best bet is to ditch the bio balls when you can. They really don't help that much in a freshwater setup. The ceramic / spun glass bio media (above) works much better.

You can't have too much bio media in your setup. Well you can, but the only thing it will hurt is your wallet. Nitrifying bacteria will reproduce at a rate to match their food source...ammonia. (or jimmy johns gargantuan) You can have too little bio media - ie not enough surface area for the bacteria to colonize and take apart the ammonia. If you have too much bio meida, the only risk is that it may not be fully utilized to it's potential. That is... the amount of bacteria in the system might not be very densly populated on a very large amount of bio media. No harm to the tank.. just your wallet. You're always best to put in as much bio media as you can afford to fit. It doesn't go bad - just needs to be rinsed so it's really a one time investment. If you use the link I posted above... it's super cheap.

Silicone II GASP!! I would seriously take this apart and redo this. When building aquariums / sumps / anything aquatic GE silicone I is to be used NOT silicone II. Silicone II contains mold inhibitors and anti fungal chemicals. Silicone II will say not for use in aquariums right on the tube. And you especially do not want GE silicone II kitchen and bath. Clear GE silicone I is what you want to use. 100% pure silicone.

I would replace the tub.... drill a hole and just use a bulk head. No need for any silicone if you drill the right size hole ;)

Very cool.. please keep posting on this setup. And yes I know what the pump itself looks like, I wanted to see how you had it positioned and plumbed. :P

Thanks for sharing!!
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Post Posted: Mon Jul 18, 2011 11:51 pm   Re: 1200 GPH Custom Filtration System

Can the ring be totally submerged?

And I'm looking into the Silicone 2 situation now, the bottle says 100% silicone which is good, and it doesn't say mildew resistant which is also good. And people said Silicone I window and door is best, and this is Silicone II Window/Door/Attic/Basement, so I would imagine it's extremely close to the Silicone I, 100% silicone is 100% silicone, whether it's labeled 1 or 2 is the impression i got from a cichild forum I just read. It says not for use in aquariums, at the very end of the first instructions, I missed that when I bought it. Again that same cichild forum said that GE put that on almost all their products because people were using it as a glue basically to build aquariums, and silicone isn't a glue, it's a sealant, and the aquariums were falling apart and people were suing. Do you have some references or sources saying that 100% silicone II is toxic for aquariums??

The fact they only slightly mention it makes me believe they said it to prevent people using it as a glue, and not for toxic reasons. I currently have gold fish in there, and one poster said if the goldfish last 3 days, then the silicone is probably safe, so I will be watching for random goldfish deaths to see if the silicone is toxic or not! Wish me luck that all my hard work on that won't be undone!
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Post Posted: Tue Jul 19, 2011 2:38 am   Re: 1200 GPH Custom Filtration System

BRuTAL_HiTMAN_ wrote:it's the basement, the man cave, and I live at school 8 months out of the year, and a lot of that stuff is stuff from my dorm, so it all gets cleaner when I go back to school ;)


Man Cave. Check.
Menacing user name. Check.
Dog playing in snow 12-month calendar. Check. :)

There are lots of discussion on GE silicone for aquariums. Silicone I is considered to be safe (though some dispute it) and some people do use II, but that's a very small group. I gave up because it endlessly went back on forth in some forums and I just gave in and bought aquarium silicone. Since our pets can't talk to us, it's better to side with safety.
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Post Posted: Tue Jul 19, 2011 9:01 am   Re: 1200 GPH Custom Filtration System

steve wrote:Man Cave. Check.
Menacing user name. Check.
Dog playing in snow 12-month calendar. Check. :)


it's all about balance, gotta come off hardcore twice as hard for every non-hardcore thing you do ;) haha!

steve wrote:There are lots of discussion on GE silicone for aquariums. Silicone I is considered to be safe (though some dispute it) and some people do use II, but that's a very small group. I gave up because it endlessly went back on forth in some forums and I just gave in and bought aquarium silicone. Since our pets can't talk to us, it's better to side with safety.


I completely agree! If i didn't already have it done, I would have at least bought GE silicone I. Right now I'm just watching my fish and hoping everything turns out ok. The current feeling I have is that at one point maybe a lot of these sealants were toxic, but have since been sorted, possibly due to lawsuits? Anyone else getting that vibe? It also said it was not intended for use that would require FDA approval or something to that effect, which would definitely make me believe that it's not toxic, but they just didn't feel the need to submit to the FDA's ridiculous standards for all of their sealants on a product that will most likely not be for those purposes. Thoughts on that?
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Post Posted: Tue Jul 19, 2011 10:15 am   Re: 1200 GPH Custom Filtration System

I've done much research on this including calling both GE and driving up to All Glass (now aqueon) in franklin wisconsin and talking with them. GE was the supplier of silicone for all glass (all glass is the aquarium silicone sold by aqueon). I don't know if they have switched suppliers since Aqueon bought all-glass. The all glass silicone was identical to clear GE silicone I. Most everyone uses Silicone I and not silicone II for aquariums. Though there are many people that have used silicone II, it's generally not a good idea.

Silicone II has a chemical additive that makes it cure quicker. Silicone II comes in both kitchen and bath (has mold inhibitors) and window and door (does not have mold inhibitors). Silicone II is closer chemically to GE's industrial glazing silicones.

Clear Silicone II window and door is GE5000
Clear Silicone I window and door is GE012A

The packaging is misleading. The manufacturer can basically claim whatever they want to be "100% silicone". So 100% silcione is NOT 100% silicone. Look at the chemical list on the msds sheets for two products labeled as "100% silicone".
There are 6 listed ingredients on the GE silicone II and only 4 listed on the GE silicone I.

Here are the two MSDS sheets for the products. You can see that while both say 100% silicone, they are chemically different. I used to have a copy of the all-glass msds silicone sheet for comparison. I no longer have the file. I just contacted via a web form aqueon asking them to send a msds sheet for the clear silicone.

http://www.setonresourcecenter.com/msdshazcom/htdocs//MSDS/Retail/S/SILICONE%20RUBBER%20SEALANT%20GE5000.pdf

http://www.homedepot.com/catalog/pdfImages/2b/2b4de67e-87cb-4e48-b395-3ff978de0f7b.pdf
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Post Posted: Tue Jul 19, 2011 10:56 am   Re: 1200 GPH Custom Filtration System

Good links to the fact sheets, quickly glanced over them! We'll see what happens to the gold fish within the next few days, hopefully all will be well.

Looking at the ingredients, it has one extra hazardous material, however they both contain two other hazardous materials. With some googling I found this:

http://kmf.pa.msu.edu/MSDS/HMDS.pdf

it lists the health rating as moderate, and this is assuming that it is pure Hexamethyldisilazane, which it is not. I'm really leaning towards that it should be fine, but only time will tell.
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Post Posted: Tue Jul 19, 2011 11:02 am   Re: 1200 GPH Custom Filtration System

If you read through the reef forums (ie reef central) you'll many have tried the silicone II and have had issues. More than a few have scrapped their work and started over.
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