Urgent Care :: TANK NOT CYCLING FOR OVER 1 MO./CONCERN FOR SALLY'S HEALTH!

[Sally's Mom]

How big is your turtle? 8"
How long have you had it? 6 yrs.

What is the water temperature? 80
Did you use a thermometer? yep
Are you using a water heater? yep
How much water is in there? 75 gal.
Are you using a water conditioner? yep
Are you using any filtration? of course

What is the basking temperature? 90
Is there a basking light? yep
Is there a basking platform that is easy to climb on? yep
What kind is it or what is it made out of? egg crate and she's used it for 2 years
Is there a UVB light? YEP

What have you been trying to feed it? PELLETS/ TUNA FISH
When was the last time your turtle ate? FEW DAYS AGO

How big is the tank/pond/enclosure? 75 GALLONS
Is the tank near a window? CLOSE BUT NOT TOO CLOSE
Is the tank in a room with a lot of activity? YES, SHE'S ALWAYS BEEN IN THE KITCHEN AND ALWAYS LOVEd THE MOVEMENT

Have you read the Basic Care section? YEP
Have you searched the forums for similar situations? YEP, BUT NEED AN "EXPERIENCED" TURTLE KEEPERS ADVICE.

Is there any other unusual activity/symptoms? NO BASKING, BARELY EATING...DIFFERENT..lurking at bottom of the tank

I really need the help of an old timer from this site here please.

I've never had tank problems but a bit over 1 month ago I had to do a complete tank change. Long story short, there is ammonia in my tap water. Use a Rena XP3 canister filter; bought a new o-ring, and zeolite to combat the ammonia problem. the tank just won't seem to cycle and now I'm concerned about my 8" res Sally. I had her in a basket in the sun today because she has not basked in 2 days...not like her at all.

forget pellets, forget veggies, and now forget bits of tuna fish(in water). I'm now besides myself. I cannot get the filter to clear the water. she's the only one in the tank and I stripped it of everything else. I'm worried and really need the help of a turtle keeper who's been around, I've been off this group for a while because we've been plugging along beautifully but I've hit an emergency and would appreciate the help of someone's who's been on this group for a long while because I believe it's going to take some real detective work to figure this out.

I tried researching the forums before writing but no longer see the moderators or contributors that I know to be true turtle experts...is someone still lurking? Please, I need real help...I've done everything right but it's still wrong and I don't want to lose my girl over it!!

[TheComputerGremlin]

Okay, first, relax! A little bit of ammonia won't hurt her, so don't crazy panic, but we definitely need to get this worked out. A few questions to answer (and yes, I have a Rena XP3):

1) How long have you had your Rena? Are you sure it's still working well? Good flow rate? No clogs?

2) When was the last time you replaced things in your Rena? Mainly talking about any activated carbon and the white pad, but also any bio stars or ceramic rings.

3) During the complete tank change, did your bio stars or ceramic rings sit in tank water or did you clean them as well (i.e. kill your beneficial bacteria)?

So, now that we have those questions out of the way, let's go through why you cleaned it in the first place:

4) Why did you clean the tank completely? (Did it relate to your move?)

5) What did you use to clean your tank? Vinegar? Bleach solution?

Now on to questions about basking:

6) When was the last time you saw her bask? Has she basked since you did the complete tank change?

My turtle has gone literally weeks without basking because she didn't want to. It's not life or death if they don't bask for a few weeks, it's not having the ability to bask for years that hurts them.

7) Have you had your water professionally tested? What did the analysis say?

If you haven't had it tested, take a sample to PetSmart/Petco and have them test it for you, or buy some test strips. It's good to know what's going on because just having ammonia in your tank should be removed with the beneficial bacteria once you get it built back up.

On to solutions:

A) Redo the tank again. It's a pain, yes, and really a last resort. But an option, so be ready to take it.

B) Do a 25% water change every day for the next week. This frequently helps a lot more than you would think.

C) Stop feeding in the tank for a few days/weeks. The "bits of tuna" concern me. Sometimes the bioload is just too much for even the best filter to handle.

D) Buy a new filter. Technically, 75 gallons is on the brink of acceptable for a Rena XP3, you may need to upgrade to a Rena XP4 or a Fluval FX5.

E) There is a product that they sell in the pet stores that has beneficial bacteria in it. You squirt some in the tank and it is supposed to help get the tank started. Normally you don't need it, but in your case, it may help out. You are just starting with so much more ammonia than normal.

The one time that I had cloudy water syndrome, it lasted about 5.5 weeks. That was with a 40 gallon tank that for some reason got cloudy. It went away on its own, but it took time. Until then, my turtle was fine. I would buy some of those test strips and test the water daily and stop feeding the tuna fish for now. I think that if you test daily, you'll see the ammonia levels start to decrease and the nitrates increase. That's what you want to see. It sometimes just takes time. If you decide to go the 25% water change route, you may want to try some water from another source that doesn't have ammonia in it, like store water. Or get something to filter the water before you put it in the tank.

[Sally's Mom]

Okay, first, relax! A little bit of ammonia won't hurt her, so don't crazy panic, but we definitely need to get this worked out. A few questions to answer (and yes, I have a Rena XP3):

1) How long have you had your Rena? Are you sure it's still working well? Good flow rate? No clogs? I JUST REPLACED THE O-0RING AND NEW TUBING LINES AND THE FLOW RATE IS GOOD.

2) When was the last time you replaced things in your Rena? Mainly talking about any activated carbon and the white pad, but also any bio stars or ceramic rings. THERE IS NEW CARBON, BIO-CHEM ZORB AND ZEOLITE WAS ADDED FOR THE AMMONIA...I DON'T USE THE WHITE PAD.

3) During the complete tank change, did your bio stars or ceramic rings sit in tank water or did you clean them as well (i.e. kill your beneficial bacteria)? THE CERAMICS WERE RINSED IN TANK WATER BUT WHEN i CLEANED THE FILTER, I FILLED IT WITH CLEAN TAP WATER, SO IT MIGHT HAVE DISRUPTED THE GOOD BACTERIA BUT I EXPECTED A BLOOM BECAUSE OF IT.

So, now that we have those questions out of the way, let's go through why you cleaned it in the first place:

4) Why did you clean the tank completely? (Did it relate to your move?)
GEE, IT'S BEEN A COMEDY OF ERRORS REALLY...MONTHS AGO, I HAD PURCHASED ROSY REDS FOR HER BUT MUST HAVE BEEN GIVEN GOLDFISH INSTEAD BECAUSE THEY GREW TREMENDOUS. SALLY BEGAN RIPPING INTO THE FISH BUT THEY WERE TOO BIG TO EAT. I DID THE TANK CHANGE BECAUSE IT HAD BEEN MONTHS SINCE I HAD DONE IT (ALWAYS DID PARTIALS), BUT THE LEVELS GOT WAY OFF.
5) What did you use to clean your tank? Vinegar? Bleach solution?
I USE TANK CLEANER WIPES
Now on to questions about basking:

6) When was the last time you saw her bask? Has she basked since you did the complete tank change? SHE BASKED A FEW DAYS AGO BUT MY HUSBAND SPOOKED HER WHEN HE ADDED SOME WATER TO THE TANK AND SHE FLEW OFF THE BASKING AREA ON TO THE FLOOR! SHELL WAS OKAY BUT IT MIGHT EXPLAIN WHY SHE'S NOT BEEN BACK UP. I HAD HER IN THE SUN YESTERDAY AND WILL DO IT AGAIN THIS AFTERNOON.

My turtle has gone literally weeks without basking because she didn't want to. It's not life or death if they don't bask for a few weeks, it's not having the ability to bask for years that hurts them. THAT'S GOOD TO KNOW! SHE SEEMS PERKIER, MORE ACTIVE TODAY, SO THAT'S A GOOD THING.

7) Have you had your water professionally tested? What did the analysis say? I HAVE A MASTER TEST KIT AND THE NITRITE AND NITRATE LEVELS WERE AT ZERO BUT THE AMMONIA WAS OFF THE CHARTS, SO I WAS DOING PARTIALS BUT MIGHT HAVE DONE TOO MANY (SOMETIMES I DID IT EVERYDAY AND DID NOT WAIT AT LEAST 2 DAYS WHICH I HAVE BEEN DOING FOR A COU[PLE OF WEEKS.

If you haven't had it tested, take a sample to PetSmart/Petco and have them test it for you, or buy some test strips. It's good to know what's going on because just having ammonia in your tank should be removed with the beneficial bacteria once you get it built back up.

On to solutions:

A) Redo the tank again. It's a pain, yes, and really a last resort. But an option, so be ready to take it.

B) Do a 25% water change every day for the next week. This frequently helps a lot more than you would think.
I DID A 25% YESTERDAY AND TODAY, THANK GOODNESS, IT SEEMS AS IF THE TANK IS CLEARING UP. GOT TO TEST THE LEVELS AND I'LL WRITE BACK.

C) Stop feeding in the tank for a few days/weeks. The "bits of tuna" concern me. Sometimes the bioload is just too much for even the best filter to handle.
WELL, I HAD FEED HER TUNA BUT I AGREE WITH YOUR IDEA TO LET OFF FEEDING FOR A FEW DAYS...THE PELLETS ARE ADDING WASTE TO THE TANK THAT I'VE HAD TO KEEP SKIMMING OUT ANYWAY.

D) Buy a new filter. Technically, 75 gallons is on the brink of acceptable for a Rena XP3, you may need to upgrade to a Rena XP4 or a Fluval FX5.
THE XP3 SHOULD FILTER 175 GALLONS, SO AT 75 GALLONS IT SHOULD DO A GOOD JOB...NO?

E) There is a product that they sell in the pet stores that has beneficial bacteria in it. You squirt some in the tank and it is supposed to help get the tank started. Normally you don't need it, but in your case, it may help out. You are just starting with so much more ammonia than normal. YOU MIGHT BE RIGHT ABOUT USING AN ADDITIVE.

The one time that I had cloudy water syndrome, it lasted about 5.5 weeks. That was with a 40 gallon tank that for some reason got cloudy. It went away on its own, but it took time. Until then, my turtle was fine. I would buy some of those test strips and test the water daily and stop feeding the tuna fish for now. I think that if you test daily, you'll see the ammonia levels start to decrease and the nitrates increase. That's what you want to see. It sometimes just takes time. If you decide to go the 25% water change route, you may want to try some water from another source that doesn't have ammonia in it, like store water. Or get something to filter the water before you put it in the tank.

I REALLY APPRECIATE YOUR WRITING TO ME TO CHECK WHERE I'M AT...IT SEEMS LIKE I'M DOING THE RIGHT THINGS DOESN'T IT? I'LL DO THE LEVELS TEST AND WILL WRITE BACK.