Urgent Care :: RES Possible Resp Infection Advice

[AndrewA]

Hello,


I think my RES is developing a Resp Infection and I was for looking help/advice.

RES Female, 60 bowfront gallon tank, water temp is 80 degrees, basking temp 92 degrees.

Symptoms:

1.) She is making noises. I don't know if they're considered wheezing,as I never heard a turtle wheeze. There are 3 diffrernt kinds of sounds. One's like a squeak, the second is croak almost like a frog, and the third might be discribed as a purring sound. I know that sounds crazing, but I am being sincere.

2.) When basking or sticking her head out of the water, her mouth does open and close. Normally her neck is exteded towrds her basking light when she does this.

3.) She is excessivly shedding. It;s been about 3 weeks and she has a clear silky skin forming around her neck and mouth when in the water.

4.)One day, when I came home from work, she did have dry mucus around her mouth. It was a one time ocassion though.

5.) She sneezes and coughs when out of the water (sometimes more than once a day), but no mucus discharges or bubbles form from her nose.

Although she has these sympotoms; her appitite has not changed as she eats a lot, ahe's active and swims daily, she loves to bask, and shows no signs of sickness.

I bought some pet food called Reptile Xtra today to see if it help, however, I want to make sure that waiting for it to work will not make matters worse.

Should I take her to a vet. If not, what recommendations are there to help her out.

Any advice would be appreciated. Thanks.


Andrew

[AndrewA]

forgot to add this:

How big is your turtle? 5 inches
How long have you had it? 1 month

What is the water temperature? 80 degrees
Did you use a thermometer? yes
Are you using a water heater? yes
How much water is in there? 45 gallons
Are you using a water conditioner? yes,
Are you using any filtration? Yes, Fluval 305

What is the basking temperature? 92 degrees
Is there a basking light? Yes, 75wat uva bulb
Is there a basking platform that is easy to climb on? Yes
What kind is it or what is it made out of? Floating dock
Is there a UVB light? Yes

What have you been trying to feed it? Reptomin, Reptile Xtra, Goldfish
When was the last time your turtle ate? Today

How big is the tank/pond/enclosure? 60 gallon bowfront
Is the tank near a window? no
Is the tank in a room with a lot of activity? Yes

Have you read the Basic Care section? Yes
Have you searched the forums for similar situations? Yes

[steve]

I don't think she has RI. When my turtles were outside during the summer, they once made a subtle croaking noise. On other occasions when they were dry for extended periods, there also appeared to be dried mucous, possibly a mineral deposit that showed up once they went back into the water.

I'm not sure about the sneezing/coughing... that might need to be looked into. By sneezing, do you mean water squirts out of the nose when she surfaces? That is not a symptom. Are the noises the only thing that is consistent?

I do recommend you try to locate a vet you're comfortable with just in case there is a need to use them.

[RyanJ]

Hmm, I'd still advise a vet visit just to rule an RI out, even though it sounds very much like one. You could try raising water temperature a bit to stimulate her immune system to fight any infection, but unfortunately for their owners a lot of turtles don't show signs of illness until they're past the point of home treatment.

[SpotsMama]

How do her eyes look? Turtle eyes are sensitive and a lot of conditions can cause them to swell or be irritated - respiratory infection and vitamin deficiency being two.

The heavy shedding may be caused by a couple of things. For one, when a turtle has been living in very dirty water, common in a pet store, then moves to a cleaner, healthier habitat, they will sometimes shed heavily for awhile, then the shedding will subside. Another very common cause of heavy skin shedding is warm water. At 80 degrees, your water temp is high enough to cause excessive skin shedding. A more normal temp for a five inch turtle would be 75 degrees or even a few degrees cooler. On the other hand, when a turtle is sick we always recommend raising the temp to around 78 or 80 to stimulate his/her immune system.

Another thing that causes heavy skin shedding is too much rich food. Since you're relatively new to turtle keeping, be sure and read up on turtle nuitrition on this site. Turtles beg unceasingly for food and it's tempting to overfeed. As large as she is, a half a headfull of good quality pellets every day is plenty (plus, of course, plenty of leaf lettuce and cuttlebone, and occasional servings of other veggies and fruit, and the very rare treat of a few minnows or guppies or gut loaded crickets.) Stay away from goldfish - too fatty for a turtle.

A couple of things suggest possible RI (two symptoms are mouth breathing and wheezing, or noisy breathing) but her behaviour doesn't. Usually a sick turtle's appetite is poor and he/she acts tired or lethargic. Swollen, irritated eyes is another common symptom.

The suggestions to go ahead and find a good herp vet are excellent. If things take a turn for the worse you really don't want to waste time trying to find one.

I'm a bit puzzled by the "clear, silky skin" around her neck. Is it like little whisps that you see floating around her when she's in the water, but that are invisible when she's out of the water? If so, that's the way skin looks when it's shedding.

By the way, I always say if it were my turtle I'd probably take her to see the vet. The down side of a trip to the vet is it's stressful for the turtle and can be (depending on the vet) expensive. The up side is that, if anything is wrong it can get treated early and, if nothing is wrong then you've got peace of mind.

If you do wind up going to see a vet, don't let the vet give your turtle a vitamin a shot unless he/she is really sure it's necessary. Too many turtles have bad reactions to the shots. A safer way to give vitamin a is with food and food supplements. I mention this because some vets seem to prescribe a vitamin a shot to all turtles as a matter of course, whether it's needed or not.

[AndrewA]

Good Morniing,

First off, I wanted to thank everybody for their advice... you guys are awsome.

Steve..thank you for the response. When she coughs and sneezes...it does not squirt water out of its nose. It is more of a dry cough or sneeze.


RyanJ..thank you as well. I raised the teperature overnight and noticed that she did not bask all night long ike she usally does. Tem in the tank now is 85 degrees. When I appraoched the tank this morning, she came right to me. unfotuatly, the noises did not stop...damn.

Sportsmama, thank you for your response as well. Her eyes look perfectly fine. The temp in my tank usd to be 78 degrees. I turned it up once the shedding started and it hasn't stopped since. According to your description, she is shedding.

All in all, I decided to take her to the vet today. Like Sportsmama said, it may be expensive but at least I will get peace of mind. It kinda sucks when your trying to relax and you hear you pet make noises and can't stop wondering what is wrong with it. I will keep everybody posted on what the vet says for future reference. Thank you all for your help, once again.

Take care,

Andrew

[TheComputerGremlin]

Definitely drop those tank temps. 85 degrees is way too high, and even 78 is too high. Three things happen with too high of temps:

1) Excessive shedding. In your case, this is also caused by being in "better" conditions now than were she came from.
2) High metabolism. This could lead to increased begging, and possible lethargy if she isn't getting enough food, but you shouldn't feed her any extra to try to remedy it, you should just lower the water temps.
3) Lack of basking. As you noticed, she didn't bask like she usually does, meaning that her shell will become soft. You need that large gradient between the water temp and the basking temp to entice basking. Turtle can healthily bask as much as a third of the day!

Drop the temps back, as Spotsmama said to between 72-75 degrees. Good luck with the vet! A vet's visit after getting a new pet is always a good idea anyways. Have the vet measure the turtle's shell length and weight, so you can take her back when she's full grown in a few years for an incredible comparison.

[megcornell]

I have to disagree with computergremlin. While 75 is an accepted temp for a healthy adult turtle, I'd keep my temperatures higher if you think he may be ill. Usually 78-80 is perfect, 85 is too warm though.
You will see excessive shedding with a higher temp, but that's ok for the short term.

I'd wait and see the vet's diagnosis before lowering the temps below 78-80.

[AndrewA]

Hello All,

So, I learned a few things with my vist to the vet. First, when people say turtle vet visits can be expensive..... they aren't kidding. I just dropped $50.00 just so the vet could look at her. That said, my RES had a minor bacterial infection, however, it did not develop into a full blown Resp Infection (which would have turned into Pneumonia...which would have been bad). The vet said she had this problem for a while, and I probably bought her from the pet store with these issues. The fact that I believe in maintaining a high standard of water quality and have my tank set up correctly, most likely saved her from becoming worse. So, I felt good about this.

For treatment, he gave her a shot of antibiotics (which was very expensive at all) and said that her symptoms should go away in the next few days. He said the excessive shedding could have been cased by the bacteria, however, it would have been more prominent on her body. He then, pretty much, agreed with you guys that the turtle was probably in a tank that wasn't as sanitary as mine and that the shedding is normal. Also said to drop the heat level back to 78 - 80 degrees.

All in all I droped like $75.00 at the vet yesterday for piece of mind, however, I learned a lot about my pet as well. My rationalization is that people sometimes spend hundreds of dollars on sick dogs and cats and their life expectancy is not nearly as long as a turtle. So, although it was a little pricey, my turtle is going to be healthy and that makes the money well spent.

Anyways, thank you all for your advice and help. My turtle thanks you too!!

[SpotsMama]

I think it was money well spent too. Look at it this way - now you know what is going on. That's worth a lot. And if you hadn't gone, the bacterial infection would have gotten worse and worse. Watching a helpless turtle get sicker and sicker is a horrible experience.

Keep the temp up until you're sure your turtle is healthy, then you can drop it back down to 75 degrees. She'll probably shed rather heavily until then.